Mosrites: the 1960s vs. the 80s

[Strat-o-rama]

Some of you guys & gals have extensive experience with Mosrites from different periods of manufacture. I've often wondered if there is a difference in feel and finish to the instruments produced in the 1980s, including the last instruments to be sold under the Mosrite of California name made under the guiding hand of Semie (1993), compared to the 1960s when there was a substantial factory and the instruments were produced in large numbers (and tighter tolerances?). Did the smaller production number of the later years produce a better feeling, more hand crafted instrument, or did the larger factory system produce a consistent product that would be considered more to your personal liking. I know the answer could be yes to both, but what differences do you notice in basic overall feel, sound, fit and finish?

Granted, any two guitars of the same model same year will vary based on wood density and other details, but I'm talking about the overall end-user instrument.

[JimPage]

Strat-o-rama poses a fascinating question:
>>Did the smaller production number of the later years produce a better feeling,
>>more hand crafted instrument . . .

I have often wondered that. In the case of the 1972 Celebrity I have, I think the answer is that yes, the guitar does have a hand-crafted feel. Although the luthier-built guitars and basses I have owned have all been different, the Mosrite I have does seem to be built by an individual and not in a factory. This shows up mostly in the finish and in small details.

Luckily, a very knowledgeable forum member owned the same instrument and can provide, should he want to, his take on this question. Dennis, your thoughts?

I wonder how many Mosrites PER YEAR were produced in Semie's lifetime. I would love to see a chart or spreadsheet on that subject.

--Jim

[oipunkguy]

The first mosrite I ever feel in love with was johnny ramone's white ventures 2. when I first saw the ventures/mark one model in a magazine I actually didn't care for it much. Then one day I went to a local guitar shop (when it was still had cool vintage instruments) called Classic Axe in Manassas, Virginia. And sitting in the corner was a 88 model in a sunburst. I bought a Univox hi-flier bass and a dano Hodad from the owner Russ, so he knew me, and he said "hey Aaron, you got to try out this guitar I just got in. As soon as I got this guitar I thought of you." lol. I would ask him if he had seen any mosrites in his shop every time I took a visit to his store.
When I sat down and played this guitar I was truly blown away. Ever since then the ventures one, no matter what era, was my favorite guitar of all time.
later on I thought what would make these guitars perfect for me is if they had humbuckers and 4 knobs like a les paul. at that time I had no idea Mosrite had made such a thing. and one faithful day (for me at least) in the year 2000 I found a VII on ebay. My eyes popped out of my head and my jaw dropped. There really was such a thing! At the end of the auction there was a lot of people bidding on it, but I was determined to win. my last bid for this guitar was for two thousand, and I won the auction at 1800.
I think I only had 500 bucks in the bank at the time. Luckily the seller was very nice, and allowed me to pay him in payments and my room mates were nice enough to help with my part of the regular bills we had to pay in our apartment.
When I finally got the guitar, the seller had told me that this guitar was his uncle's that had since passed away in the 1970's. So this guitar hadn't had a string change in 20 years. there was even rust on the frets and on the back of the neck plate. But I took of the old strings and lovingly cleaned her up. And that guitar has been with me ever since, and always will.

It was so exciting to me to play a guitar that you knew from first touch was made with loving care. Built in soul, you're d*** right. it's was not like any other guitar in the world. You don't know what that is like until you play an old mosrite.
Now on the 65-66 models I've played, although it's been a while, I thought kept with this "feel" even in the factory building period, in my opinion.
On my V2's the unique thing that the soft carve on the horns are at slightly different angles. even the neck profile isn't the exact same.
I'd sure like to hear what GTSP has to say on this matter It's been about 14 years now since I first played that 88 model for the first time, and it's the only 80's model I've ever had a chance to play.
hope everyone enjoyed my little story, this thread just reminded me of it, so thanks for letting me reminisce

[JimPage]

Aaron wrote:
>>hope everyone enjoyed my little story . . .

Those stories are wonderful, and I am sure everyone enjoyed that one as much as I did.

We've been very lucky to become aware of these great instruments, and every instrument has stories to tell.

--Jim

[Dennisthe Menace]

Nice post oipunkguy!

Strat-o-rama had posted:

what differences do you notice in basic overall feel, sound, fit and finish?

I'll try to keep this brief but it will be difficult.....Trent, there actually was a big difference between the 60s AND the 70s
guitars and still more changes in the 80s. But the biggest difference between the 60s and 70s/80s were the shape AND
feel of the neck. A lot of people say the 70/80s necks were a lot thinner and wider. I believe the neck was actually the
same thickness, however the wider neck made it feel as though it was thinner. Also the absence of the speed frets from
the 60s made it easier to bend notes without the string slipping from underneath your finger. Another HUGE difference
was the option of ordering Humbucking pick-ups with V & T or 2V & 2T (Gibson set up) as oipunkguy had mentioned in
his post. The only thing scary on the 70s Mo's were the Finish on them (Solid Bodies only) were always cracking or least
the majority of the ones I have seen down here in SoFlo....maybe heat and humidity??? I'm not sure why, but then again,
why haven't I seen this on the 60s and 80s models ???

Did the smaller production number of the later years produce a better feeling, more hand crafted instrument

I believe that the 60s/70s/80s were all hand crafted instruments to an extent, I myself preferring the wider neck & H'buckers.
Jim, your Celebrity IS such a beast with the wider neck which IMHO is the more comfortable playing neck. And again you have
other folks that prefer the 60s neck, so it would be more of a personal preference.....

p.s. Just an off-note about some folks mentioning VIIs and VIIIs as V2s and V3s....they are not.....Sometime back on the
Forum and I don't remember how it happened, the postings started showing up as VIIs and VIIIS. Somehow the term "MARK'
had been dropped. For the record, these Beasts are actually MARK VIIs and MARK VIIIs (7s and 8s ) just to set
the record straight

[Veenture]

hope everyone enjoyed my little story, this thread just reminded me of it, so thanks for letting me reminisce

These are exactly the kind of stories that help the sustain of the "built in soul" that this forum also has. Thank you Aaron, for reminiscing

[oipunkguy]

For the record, these Beasts are actually MARK VIIs and MARK VIIIs (7s and 8s ) just to set
the record straight

Hey Dennis, the actually correct term for my mosrite is a Mark V II, meaning V two. I've seen it written three ways VII, V II, or V2. I have no idea which one is correct, so I just accept all three. another point, is these guitars serial number always began with 2V.... I own 2V0110 (my first mark V II) and the second one 2V0042. opposed to the serial numbers on the standard mark model in the 70's just began with V.

Interesting points on the finish cracking Dennis. Some nitro lacquer check more then others. one reason I usually lend towards using Deft for clear coating. it has anti-checking agents in the lacquer. of course the stuff can still crack on ya if you aren't careful. Didn't Danny mention that in 66 that a lot of the factory mosrites there were clear coated with a catalyzed poly when he worked there? Another point to mention, when finishing with nitro, the thicker the finish (meaning the amount of coats applied), the better chance you have for chipping or cracking, on the other hand if it's too thin, shrinkage in the finish occurs much quicker. I've seen some thin finishes, even though it's great for tone, will just plain separate from the guitar. I've seen this on poly finishes as well. Sometimes a wood stain used might just not "agree" with a particular finish. Could be factors in the shop when it was done too, it's hard to know why a lot of the times since there's usually no issues until several months or years later.
There's other factors too, like for example rosewood and swamp ash is harder to finish then other common guitar woods...
I could go on and on, but getting a little bit off topic here, my bad.

[KRamone27]

Sorry to hijack the thread for a sec but Aaron I member Russ. Didn't he move his store towards Haymarket, VA off Jeff Davis hwy?

[oipunkguy]

Hey Kev,

Yeah, he's in Gainville now, right where route 29 and I-66 meet. I don't know how long it's been since you been back to this area, but they have really built up gainsville a lot. Russ' new store is in a shopping center with a bunch of other cookie cutter style shoppes. What I really like about Russ is he always carried guitars no one else did, for the longest time it was the only place to go to find old Kustom amps, G&L, PRS, Rain song, and a bunch of others I can't remember right now. First time I ever saw a mark v or a double neck mosrite was in his shop as well.
Today he still carries unique guitars, but what I don't like is all the vintage gear isn't around anymore. Kind of a bummer.

[KRamone27]

I thin I know the shopping center you are talking about. Next to the grocery store and across from Burger king? It's been about 6 years since I've been back in that area but need to get back there and see my parents and family.